That’s equivalent to 2%, and I don’t believe it is hefty. Making huge transaction does kick you in the wallet if you want to opt in for convenience. My point from the previous replies still stand true in a sense that you are in charge to determine whether the fee is worth your time or not. Remember, nobody is forced to do so, and in the history of years of PW, people are doing fine with trading expensive items in trade worlds. There should be absolutely no extra pressure to them to use PWE which then leads to them complaining about the high fee.
Because this game does require you to invest some of your personal time. Grinding takes place in almost every corner of this game. You fish 3 hours a day, some others go mining for 4 hours a day. There needs to be effort and time put for the game to ‘reward’ you with something. The same thing applies with using PWE. The game offers you such a convenient way to sell your item without you having to be online. You can just pop in, put the listing, and join back tomorrow or two days later to get your item sold. You don’t worry a single thing, you don’t waste your time which can be put into other things in the game. That’s what they are selling to you. And if you somehow force yourself to believe that you need their service so badly to the point that you aren’t willing to do the labor yourself, then you are expected to pay the premium (10%).
Nobody likes to grind if they can be given free money and items by just logging in. Does this mean the game should take this route and give everyone free Tormentor Wings? Trust me, 90% of the players would love this.
This benefits everyone in the long run. With how chaotic and easy it is for the current game to keep pumping Byte Coins into existence, it needs a reliable way to make sure a good portion of those dumped in are being thrown out at consistent rate. This game benefits everyone who sees Byte Coin as currency (which regardless of your stance about WL vs BC, will happen after the last announcement).
As mentioned above, money sink feature is important.
Plenty of other ways to money sink than to take 10% from everything you sell disappear, as I said before. If the game has so little content that they can’t figure out other ways to money drain (like elite water gun) then that’s just a red flag.
There’s a reason expensive items aren’t being sold, because there aren’t enough bytes to go around because of this tax, and the players who do have enough bytes are losing too much. The fact that you want this feature in game instead of new content and ways to use bytes simply baffles me.
And regarding all the ways players can get bytes “pumped into a game”
One single purchase tax takes away more bytes that I have earned from quests, recyclers, and other in-game byte collection methods in a lifetime. It’s near impossible to get a middle-class item from the PWE solely by earning bytes from PW features alone. If they thought tax was to be a money sink, then they wouldn’t have added more ways to get bytes later on in the game.
Also, this literally only benefits buyers.
Nothing implies the devs are supporting the idea of trade worlds, heck, some of them may not even know what trade worlds are, and there’s no evidence that states PWE was made as an optional service. That’s where all the bytes in game go.
If they’re going to make a “main currency” while they also make an item untradeable that people have been using for years, there’s no problem with trying their best to satisfy the majority, and you clearly want the majority to lose interest in the game
I completely agree with this. Developer needs to figure out other creative ways to money drain. However, until that time comes and it has been proven to be working (enough players use those features), then I’d say stick with 10%.
I don’t see it the same way as you do. The way I see it is that people are less likely to pay upfront cost of 100,000 BC for the convenience they’d gain and instead simply use good-old trading world—which is perfectly fine since players who, for some reason, need the convenience have this feature accessible to them provided they are willing to pay the premium.
The fact that the money collected from PWE seller goes into abyss hits the nail that it is indeed a money sink. As for whether they keep adding ways to earn Byte Coins and not balancing it with additional money sink features is beyond me. Trust me, I’ve complained about this even on Discord and you can even look it up. However, it does not change the fact that PWE service fee is a money sink feature.
I beg to differ. I do not see a single potential benefit to buyers. Due to the service fee, sellers are now being forced to sell their items higher than they normally would on their shop worlds or trade worlds. This fee (full or partial) is then passed along into buyers. Even in the instance that the seller eats the fee, it still does not benefit the buyer in any way, shape, or form.
The fact that they are not taking away our ways to trade traditionally, and you can continue to do so is the evidence to this statement. You are not required to trade using PWE, thus it is an optional choice for select players depending on their circumstances. Keep in mind that they also do not add automated tax system on conventional trade system where you meet directly with the buyer to disincentive trading this way.
I believe this is not the main argument topic. I am pretty sure you are there when I declared that I was against being artificially forced to use Byte Coins not because of market adores, rather due to it being mandatory.
My statements above are more than enough evidence that a 10% tax is too much of a money drain.
One single PL purchase is more bytes than the average player makes from default features in a lifetime. One purchase loses more bytes than probably 10 or more players will ever get. I make countless purchases.
Many of these players don’t resort to trading because of tax, some will just give up all together because both methods are frustrating in their own right. Some players may even stick to PWE because they don’t even realize there’s a tax to begin with. There’s a reason items above 2pl aren’t sold in the PWE, because the tax alone costs the net worth of a dozen average players.
Everything points toward this being too much of a money sink, as well as countless players quitting / withdrawing payments / negative reviews, and if they intended it to be as such then they would have added more ways to do it, or at least given us the reason by now — but I bet the reality of the situation is we can both agree they aren’t even paying attention to how many bytes are even in the game, and over-saturation has never been an issue.
2pl is hefty it doesn’t matter if it’s 2 percent or not
2pl is the right price when you can just go and trade the item 10pl is crazy.
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And what is this “default features”? Achievements and daily/clan quest? Keep in mind that those are in no way any sort of primary income. It is a side gig similar to how you do Uber every weekend just to get some pocket money or make a lemonade stand or other homemade foods and sell it to your neighborhood. They are never meant to provide you a big enough money that you can live off of it.
This is another invalid argument as typical average joe’s won’t even be doing this highly expensive trades in the millions. Those who are able to afford this must choose whether the so-called “big price” is worth saving their time of idling at trade worlds or not.
It has yet to be an issue because virtually everyone chose to use WL. Now that it’s finally down to the point where people have to use BC, it may or may not be an issue. We have no way of knowing this until the update has passed and adequate time shows what the economy is going to look like.
And what is this “default features”? Achievements and daily/clan quest? Keep in mind that those are in no way any sort of primary income. It is a side gig similar to how you do Uber every weekend just to get some pocket money or make a lemonade stand or other homemade foods and sell it to your neighborhood. They are never meant to provide you a big enough money that you can live off of it.
You can very easily live off of those features, and it is a primary way of getting income for many players, or why else would you mention this as a result of inflation. You don’t need a job in PW. You can sell things online in real life but there isn’t a 10% tax.
This is another invalid argument as typical average joe’s won’t even be doing this highly expensive trades in the millions. Those who are able to afford this must choose whether the so-called “big price” is worth saving their time of idling at trade worlds or not.
I never mentioned millions, because literally nobody in PWE makes orders in the millions, even though many items cost millions, because literally everyone who does that realizes there’s too much loss
That right there is where I disagree. Achievement and daily quests should not be your primary source of income. They are never meant to be considering the fact that there is not even any guarantee or prediction of what’s going to come next. Being dependent on something random (may or may not come to you) is just plain stupidity.
This is why I like people to start referring to PWE provision as service fee rather than tax. You use their service, and you pay accordingly, similar to how you set up a seller account on Amazon and have to pay 15% of ALL SALES to Amazon just to use their platform. So yes, there is not 10% tax depending on whether you earn capital gain or not (if you sell your item more than when you bought it, then you are required by law to report it), but there is service fee for using platforms like Amazon and eBay.
Regardless of what you stated, your implication was that an expensive items in the hundreds of thousands or even millions will make you pay a sum of money that’s average joe will never earn through side gigs like Achievements rewards and Quests. The issue with that is you plunge in average players who won’t even see any of those expensive items inside their inventory to begin with. That’s like complaining that a big company like Gigabyte having to pay millions of dollar for their sales in Amazon by claiming that civilian like you and me will never even make that amount by doing Uber. It does not make sense.
That right there is where I disagree. Achievement and daily quests should not be your primary source of income. They are never meant to be considering the fact that there is not even any guarantee or prediction of what’s going to come next. Being dependent on something random (may or may not come to you) is just plain stupidity.
There is a guarantee for bytes in quests, clan quests and achievements. Who are you to say what people can rely on and what they can’t rely on? You don’t determine another players goals or what they want to buy.
Nobody likes to grind if they can be given free money and items by just logging in. Does this mean the game should take this route and give everyone free Tormentor Wings? Trust me, 90% of the players would love this.
No they wouldn’t. Just like when jake put a bunch of heart swords into circulation, there was an outrage. There was even an outrage when he gave away ONE dracula cape. The only people who would be happy are the minority who think they’d never be able to get the item - now it’s worthless.
Regardless of what you stated, your implication was that an expensive items in the hundreds of thousands or even millions will make you pay a sum of money that’s average joe will never earn through side gigs like Achievements rewards and Quests. The issue with that is you plunge in average players who won’t even see any of those expensive items inside their inventory to begin with. That’s like complaining that a big company like Gigabyte having to pay millions of dollar for their sales in Amazon by claiming that civilian like you and me will never even make that amount by doing Uber. It does not make sense.
It does make sense if you paid attention to the original point about it being a functional money sink or not. Why can’t you just make up your mind about whether you want things to change or not? There’s plenty of better ways for them to make a proper money sink and everything points towards the fact that the tax is too much, but you, who does not make any points on the other end about it, wants to “keep it the way it is because why not” despite the fact that the majority of players, just like those who were against making wls untradeable, did not want this change.
You are completely ignoring the fact that the devs frequently go against the wishes of the majority of the playerbase, and basically taking a dump on us as @Virtuous said.
The fact that players do not know what quest comes next makes the whole activity not a stable source of income. In one week, you may be lucky and make BC 1,000 only to make nothing the next week due to it being a RNG. It is NOT a viable main source of income. Anyone who think otherwise simply does not understand what should be considered a main source of income.
Those who scream about it are minorities. Most would not care if they are able to obtain it. Trust me, the players who actually got the extra sweetheart sword or whatever the name is was ecstatic and would be against having his reclaimed back. People love free stuff. That happens both to PW players and in real life. There’s a reason why politicians always lure in people with free stuff.
My mind is fixed. As of right now, the only functioning money sink that’s effective and is often used is PWE service fee. Compare that with multiple ways to literally create Byte Coin into the circulation (Achievement, Quests, PixelMine wheel, Recycling, Recycling Event, Gems > BC, etc). I acknowledge that having only one surefire way of taking BC out of the economy is not healthy, however as long as that is the only tool we have, we better keep it around until another alternative is added and is proven to work as effectively as this.
That is irrelevant. Majority does not always mean it’s the best, especially considering the fact that most players are below 18 year old. I am not saying that the devs are always or mostly in the right track. I have seen myself disagreeing with the features or changes they implement into the game. However, the wish of most players (questionable on how you even make sure the things you have in mind are agreed upon by 50% + 1 of total PW players) is not always the way to go.
The fact that players do not know what quest comes next makes the whole activity not a stable source of income. In one week, you may be lucky and make BC 1,000 only to make nothing the next week due to it being a RNG. It is NOT a viable main source of income. Anyone who think otherwise simply does not understand what should be considered a main source of income.
It is a viable source of income, have you even done quests before? “in one week”? You realize you get over 3 quests every few hours right? Not to mention if you don’t get bytes as a reward, you get items that can also be sold for bytes? There’s even perks that shorten the quests even more. Even with that perk, many players such as me don’t find it worthwhile to do quests anymore.
How can you say people can’t have a “steady source of income” in a game where income isn’t a necessity?
My mind is fixed. As of right now, the only functioning money sink that’s effective and is often used is PWE service fee. Compare that with multiple ways to literally create Byte Coin into the circulation (Achievement, Quests, PixelMine wheel, Recycling, Recycling Event, Gems > BC, etc). I acknowledge that having only one surefire way of taking BC out of the economy is not healthy, however as long as that is the only tool we have, we better keep it around until another alternative is added and is proven to work as effectively as this.
That was literally the point of my suggestion, because everything points towards tax being an issue. If people avoid PWE that simply means there isn’t an influx of bytes but the exact opposite.
The “bytes being created into the circulation” is far outpaced by the 10% being taken away in every single purchase.
- Many players later on stop doing quests all together because many don’t see it worthwhile, or only want to do it because of quests.
- You claimed these methods are not a steady way of income, so do not include it in your examples
- Considering one single purchase on PWE can take over 2 months of quests worth of BC and throw it down the drain, there’s a reason players are against this
That is irrelevant. Majority does not always mean it’s the best, especially considering the fact that most players are below 18 year old. I am not saying that the devs are always or mostly in the right track. I have seen myself disagreeing with the features or changes they implement into the game. However, the wish of most players (questionable on how you even make sure the things you have in mind are agreed upon by 50% + 1 of total PW players) is not always the way to go.
And who are you to say it is the way to go? You’re the same person who believes it should be legal to play P2P, which is basically gambling with extra steps, a feature over 70% of players were strictly against, but you and I both know the devs are not good at planning and making decisions, and there’s countless examples of “great idea, bad execution”
“50%”? How about we test that theory?
I disagree, Zero Two will never be best girl, Ichigo is by far more superior than she will ever be since Zero Two is very overrated and has genuinely a bad character, she’s obnoxious and doesn’t treat Hiro well, she doesn’t even take time to develop feelings for him unlike Ichigo who has a great personality and a unique hair style, along with a strong bond with Hiro, but that bond was broken by Zero Two by slight manipulation.
Zero Two’s overall character doesn’t even make up for a good waifu, she just met Hiro and started seducing him unlike Ichigo who acts like a genuine woman, she’s more realistic
Though comparison from the 2, Zero Two wouldn’t even make it in 2nd place since Miku is also a very good girl, a good type of tsundere with a little bit of hidden affection, she’s has more character and is very realistic compared to real women.
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it does not matter every three or six hours. When it is greatly based on certainties, then it is not a viable MAIN source of income. Anything that contributes to your wallet is a source of income. If you were to consider it as your MAIN source of income, that means you are dedicating your game time primarily doing those quests.
People do not have a stable source of income as it is completely dependent on luck. Many quests are hardly worth your time. Some even don’t give anything but XP. Over one year and a half, from my personal experience, the total amount of BC I have gained from completing quests is exactly BC 20,652. I won’t disclose how much money I have earned over my game time, but that is nowhere near the place where I can safely say, “main source of income”.
and did you not see my response to your (this one) point? I stated that I agree with that. HOWEVER, as long as we currently only have one effective and often used method to money drain, I am not confident with nerfing our last hope to prevent inflation. I am not saying that I will always be against this. As I’ve stated above, once there are alternatives that are proven to work, effective, as well as often used, then by all means start deducting or balancing it. Right now? Bad time.
- There has yet to be evidence that such expensive items are constantly being exchanged in PWE system. This means there is no “big money drained” yet from the expensive items being traded in PWE.
- Achievement, quest, and other instances that generate free Byte Coin does not give individual a significant amount. However, if you nerf the money sink as well as keeping these things going around, it is a matter of time before the currency loses its value quickly since a lot more money is being pumped WHEN COMPARED TO money being drained. They won’t make each individual rich, but collectively, and over time, they will cause issue.
- That one single purchase rarely happens versus the Recycling Event applies to literally everyone and each person can generate anywhere from 5,000 to 50,000 or more on a single night from junks. To add to this, just like I mentioned above: I am not against changing this IN THE FUTURE when we have another effective alternatives to money drain.
I do not think we should expand the current debate to P2P since it is OOT. Who am I to say? Nobody. I am simply stating that majority is not always correct. The majority can be dumb.
In some cases, I do agree with this, including making WL untradeable.
No! Nezuko is the best girl! 
it does not matter every three or six hours. When it is greatly based on certainties, then it is not a viable MAIN source of income. Anything that contributes to your wallet is a source of income. If you were to consider it as your MAIN source of income, that means you are dedicating your game time primarily doing those quests.
Nobody in this game needs a “main” source of income. That’s an optional thing that some players do to achieve their specific monetary goals. If quests aren’t worth your time, people skip them. In my experience It’s almost always nether and fishing quests which do give you prizes you can sell.
You aren’t certain if someone will buy your junk from a trade world within 3-6 hours either. At least you’re guaranteed to get something from quests, even experience can get you to level up which can get gems, which could be used to buy bytes.
There has yet to be evidence that such expensive items are constantly being exchanged in PWE system. This means there is no “big money drained” yet from the expensive items being traded in PWE.
Because it’s too much of a loss. Consistent items are being sold for over 20,000 to 50,000 bytes in PWE. The surplus of players suddenly moving to PWE will only make more players inclined to partake in this money drain. Unlike the RNG chance of monthly recycling event and quests (which both are features that barely anyone participates in, by the way) is largely outnumbered by the consistent multi-PL trades going on in PWE going on every single day. Which will only increase after they make it untradeable.
Who am I to say? Nobody. I am simply stating that majority is not always correct. The majority can be dumb.
They can be, doesn’t mean they are, and nothing yet is in favor of the opposing opinion either.
Solution, the devs should inform us about whether or not the economy has an influx, chances are they don’t know how many bytes are in the game and they have plenty of rotting assets hidden in the files that they could use as a byte drain similar to the elite watergun issue. (that they once again abandoned)
Just use your own account to compare the money you got from quests vs items you sell. You’ll see which one is tremendously giving you money. Remember that you don’t consider something that gives you 15% of all of your income to be the main source when there’s something else that gives, say, 60%+.
I doubt how you come to the conclusion that barely anyone use recycling event. Just the last event, I saw multiple players showing off how much they made, some even prepared for as far as months away prior the event. That only accounts for players who are in Discord, and there are way more players outside Discord. Considering the fact that most people are money hungry in PW, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to think there are so many players daily watching videos how to be rich despite them mostly being repetitive, and I am certain Recycling Event, having similar trait to Gold Rush, will have made it to several of those videos. We don’t know exactly how many players use this event, but from the sudden inflation of BC (used to be 1 WL = 230 BC, goes into 1 WL = 270 BC) after the event shows that this is a problem. A huge one that has yet to be addressed despite it being around for long already.
I do see that since people are keeping BC, they will be more willing to use PWE. However, as I stated above, PWE fees is literally the only thing keeping BC from inflation, and we should make sure it’s there for as long as needed, which is until another alternative is introduced AND proven to be effective.
A bit OOT again, but I am pretty sure they can pull the data anytime they want, if not already—IF they want to.
I do see that since people are keeping BC, they will be more willing to use PWE. However, as I stated above, PWE fees is literally the only thing keeping BC from inflation, and we should make sure it’s there for as long as needed, which is until another alternative is introduced AND proven to be effective.
Idk why you still keep speaking against it when they have 3 weeks to do all these changes with ease, that will benefit the community
Because I doubt they make those changes in the next update considering the main highlight of the update is Card Battle and not actual revamp of BC. They have had a bad history of treating the official currency badly, and I am skeptical over it.